whiteseducatingwhites

Dear white Vegans: This is Your Collection Agency Calling

whiteseducatingwhites:

This shit white vegans call “speciesism,” where human beings are supposedly “privileged” as a species over animals, doesn’t exist and here’s a reason why: there are nearly three times as many animal shelters in the US as there are shelters for battered women and their children. And this isn’t a new phenomenon. It is far less political, controversial, and socially inflammatory to house animals than it is to house abused women, which should immediately demonstrate structural priorities and “privileges” when it comes to these two “species.”

When white vegans compare the consumption of certain animals to racism, they are drawing a figurative comparison between human beings (who “oppress” animals) and white people (who oppress POC). By that white logic, they are also drawing a figurative comparison between animals (“oppressed” by human beings) and POC (oppressed by white people). This means they are reproducing the same kind of racist arguments that equate white folks with human beings and POC with animals. Sitting on my privileged white ass eating a hamburger is not now and will never be the same as racism. 

The cruelty, brutality, and abuse of factory farming is reprehensible. No one is denying that. But when white vegans compare eating meat to genocide, they ignore that this small privileged demographic (in comparison to the global population) is consuming excessive amounts of meat, which doesn’t even nearly constitute the same worldwide oppression and genocide POC experience. Claiming animals deserve the same civil/human rights as POC suggests that their experiences are identical, and once again equates people of color with animals. 

Consider the racial and class privilege white vegans have when making these dietary decisions in the midst of numerous farmer’s markets, health food stores, or accessible concentrations of grocery stores period. Whether it’s the ability to afford organic produce or the individual free time to prepare vegan meals, privileged personal consumer choices are not a solution to the abuse of factory farming or the social inequalities of racial oppression. Vegans with white skin maintain considerable white privilege over human beings of color who contend with the institutional and environmental racism of being segregated into neighborhoods without grocery stores, farmer’s markets, or spare land for home vegetable gardens.

As a side note: refusal to wear animal products like skins, furs, and/or leather does not morally free white vegans from wearing clothing made by oppressed people of color in sweat shops—even if that clothing comes from a thrift store.

Vegans, and white folks in general, are not qualified to compare or equate racial oppression with other forms of oppression (real or invented), because we do not know what racial oppression is like from our own experience. When millions of domesticated animals eat better than millions of POC living in poverty, a white justice crusade of personal food politics on the behalves of “oppressed” animals becomes its own punchline. What’s next? Extraterrestrialism? Where aliens oppress human beings with the use of anal probes? Wow, wait a second… isn’t it mostly white rednecks who get anally probed? Did I just discover reverse racism in extraterrestrials? Alert the white liberal media, yall.

—DD

womanistgamergirl

ladyatheist:

supervegan:

atthiscity-itlookedendless:

girlcalledbob:

faerieeglow:

There are just some things I am not willing to make comparisons of

I agree with you. It’s not that animals aren’t suffering and that it shouldn’t stop, but it’s not anywhere near the same thing as humans butchering humans for entirely meaningless and hateful reasons. That’s the sticking point for me: reason. Yes, the treatment of some animals - not all, by the way - raised for food is appalling, but at least there’s a reason behind it - food - rather than no reason that anyone with a compassionate mind can even begin to understand. Comparing it to hate crimes is like… I don’t even know, I can’t think up a crazy enough example.

Everything has a reason behind it. Mein Kampf is full of Hitler’s political idealogies and rationalizations. Just because an action has a flawed reason behind it, does not validate it, or make it somehow more acceptable.

Slaughter is slaughter, genocide is genocide, innocence is innocence, and compassion is compassion. And it seems as though these have been warped and distorted to suit personal opinions.

^^

By your logic, faeriee: The Holocaust would have been acceptable if the Germans had eaten the Jews, or what?

Maybe you should question why you don’t like those comparisons instead on trying to call out those who do. You don’t seem to know, other than it being a knee-jerk reaction to the mention of something you have been told was unparalleled in it’s cruelty.

You’ll soon find that there is no logical way to object to these comparisons and remain non-speciesist. 

(This post still provides no counter to the arguments brought to you; just another reiteration of your initial post. All you have done is add that you think that it is OK to kill non-human animals for food…)

Did I really just see someone compare eating meat to the fucking HOLOCAUST. On some real shit, what the fuck is wrong with you people?!?! You’re comparing Jewish people to livestock and see no problem with this. What in the ever loving fuck is going on in your brain to make you think that’s ok? For future reference, don’t you EVER do that shit again.

dammitcaleb-deactivated20130328

Right around the time I was sobbing because we were eating chicken for the 8th fucking night in a row, my mother was drinking hot tea and beer for dinner so her children could have most of the food

nanner:

You want to fucking talk hunger? We can fucking talk hunger.

We can talk about the one time Mom gave me benadryl as soon as I got off the bus. I wasn’t sick, but there was no food in the house, so she just wanted me to sleep until I could get back to school and eat breakfast and lunch there.

Once when my brother was a baby, she gave him baby aspirin to buy her some time until she could buy more formula.

You ask her about any of these things she starts to fucking cry.

Eat lentils, eat McDonald’s, eat beef from a cow you slaughtered with your bare hands. I don’t give a fuck. But be grateful for every bite of food that passes your lips because there are millions who go hungry.

witchsistah-deactivated20111007

witchsistah:

jewelweed:

girl-germs:

combat—wombat:

bradicalmang:

tommyxvx:

The more I think about the reasons people have for not being vegan, the more upset I get. I understand that some people cannot be vegan (though it isn’t even close to the numbers that defensive omnivores would…

All I heard was, “WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHH!!! I like animals more than people of color/poor people because animals won’t tell me to shut my fucking privileged mouth and go sit down someplace!”

Yep. My oldest is allergic to soy. I’m allergic to coconut & shouldn’t eat soy for other health reasons. But hey, why let pesky details like that interfere with this grand plan? Or the fact that gardening in apartments doesn’t exactly work. Not to mention people who can’t garden for physical reasons. Or pesky details like the time it takes to garden & the fact that not everyone lives in a climate where the weather is conducive to growing large quantities of food. We should all just do what the privileged white guy thinks is best. Sorry, looking at that wall of jackass makes my slapping hand itch. He doesn’t care about the reality of the lives of the people he’s judging at all.  

moniquill

Thoughts on vegan privilege.

jewelweed:

girl-germs:

combat—wombat:

bradicalmang:

tommyxvx:

The more I think about the reasons people have for not being vegan, the more upset I get. I understand that some people cannot be vegan (though it isn’t even close to the numbers that defensive omnivores would have you believe) and I’ve gotten so tired of this discussion that the second anyone cries privilege, I just give them the benefit of the doubt. What really annoys me these days is that even if these people are actually incapable of being vegan, no one seems to want to discuss why, of all the minorities (and I use that term only in terms of representation) on which the burden could be placed, non-human animals are the ones who take the slack. What you’re saying is that some privilege is acceptable and some (particularly those that directly affect you) are not. It’s like, “Sorry, cow. Everyone’s got problems. I need to eat you and your family because that’s the way it is.” Human privilege is, in some ways, worse than any other kind of privilege. Mainly because humans seem to be the only ones who understand privilege and that in itself leads to the idea that we alone deserve ethical consideration. (So check your privilege before you assume I’m not checking mine.)

While that might make sense to some people, what I don’t understand is even if that is “the way it is”, why the fuck isn’t anyone doing anything about it? I see a lot of people concerned with privilege, hacking away at branches but never bothering to find the roots and it exposes them as frauds. Okay, you can’t be vegan because you’re below the poverty line and all you can afford is federally subsidized meat from fast food chains. Given the countless studies about health issues of non-vegan diets and given the fact that you “would totally go vegan if you could because [you] love the animals”, why the FUCK aren’t you doing anything about it? How many letters have you written to your representative? How many times have you actively participated in demonstrations against animal suffering? Why is it that despite being so concerned, just simply unable to help, most people lamenting about their inability to make the choice to go vegan haven’t done a single thing to make it better?

What people don’t seem to understand is that not supporting veganism where you can (through public voice and those times where you CAN make vegan choices) is ensuring that nothing changes. Logically, raising food to feed to food makes no sense and is a massive waste of resources and it should be no surprise that if federal subsidies were going to raising crops to eat instead of raising crops to feed to animals to eat, food would be a fraction of what it costs now. How about 5 cent veggie burgers? Wouldn’t that be a fuck ton better for the single mothers of three struggling to keep their families fed that everyone is so intent on fighting for? If you gave a fuck about anyone who can’t afford to feed their families, you should be advocating veganism at the top of your fucking lungs, not complaining that people are advocating veganism because of some idiotic notion that they don’t understand the concept of privilege.

As far as inability to go vegan because of health reasons, I am still unconvinced. Show me one (just one) case where a patient absolutely needed something only found in animals or they wouldn’t be able to function. Show me one. For those saying, “Yeah, I’d go vegan except I need so much more X to get as much Y as I get from Z”, see the previous paragraph. When the subsidies go to growing crops instead of wasting billions for hamburgers, you’ll get much more iron for much less money from dark, leafy greens and supplements than you’ll ever get from meat. Are you in a food desert? Grow your own food if you can. Don’t want to go to the grocery store twice a week? Go once a week and buy twice as much. Too expensive? START ADVOCATING VEGANISM, DUMB SHIT. Tell your government that you’re educated and you know what’s up and demand that they start selling you food that’s better for you and stop keeping people hungry with asinine systems of waste.

Yeah, there are a lot of legitimate problems that prevent some people from going vegan and they aren’t going to be solved until people stop making excuses and start putting some effort into making changes. Go vegan. If you can’t, start yelling and don’t stop until you can.

/facepalm. 

I hate capitalistic solutions to capitalistic problems. “YOU POOR PEOPLE AREN’T MAKING THE RIGHT CONSUMERIST CHOICES. IF YOU JUST VOTE WITH YOUR DOLLAR EVERYTHING WILL BE FINE”. Vomit. 

tommyxvx: Have you ever been poor? Have you ever had to work multiple jobs to try to feed your family? Have you ever lived in a food desert? How much time did you have left over to go to demonstrations and write letters to your representatives? (Also seriously your tactics suck, if that’s what you’re doing to end animal suffering you’re not making any more of a difference than people doing nothing and you might as well save your energy.)

What people don’t seem to understand is that consumer choices won’t smash capitalism, and capitalism is at the root of why a lot of folks can’t afford a vegan diet, and why most animal suffering happens in the first place. What people don’t seem to understand that animal suffering is a necessary by-product of capitalism, and advocating for reformist animal welfare measures instead of attacking the root and bringing down the whole fucking system is ensuring that nothing changes.

How about community food sovereignty and no more class society? Wouldn’t that be a fuck ton better for the single mothers of three struggling to keep their families fed that everyone is so intent on fighting for? If you gave a fuck about anyone who can’t afford to feed their families, you should be smashing the shit out of capitalism, not playing oppression olympics and pretending that having human privilege somehow means you automatically also have the class privilege to have access to a vegan diet. Capitalism fucks over non-human animals and most humans, imagine that! Capitalism by nature puts people in positions where they have to fuck over other living beings to survive.

Are you in a food desert? Then I can almost guarantee you don’t have access to land that’s anywhere near safe enough to grow food on, and you probably don’t have the time or resources to grow a garden even if you have access to land that’s not completely contaminated with industrial pollutants. When the subsidies go to growing crops instead of wasting billions for hamburgers, capitalism will still exist and there will still be exploitation because there’s no such thing as exploitation-free capitalism, and yes that means animal and human exploitation - reconfiguring agriculture subsidies is a band-aid that doesn’t threaten capitalism. Too expensive? Make total destroy and don’t be an annoying elitist. The government isn’t “yours” and seriously you don’t have to have an “education” to recognize and resist exploitation.

Capitalist vegans / pro-state vegans annoy the shit out of me.

Commentary. I know I don’t have much of an excuse living in fucking Richmond, Virginia, but here’s this. For what it’s worth.

let me get a fuck yeah on that commentary.

I need preachy vegans to go sit down somewhere & stop pushing their food choices on others. No version of our food system is without oppression of animals. Or did you think all those migrant workers were getting health benefits, decent pay, & proper living conditions? Because they’re not. Eating ethically is great, but I’m not about to give up the food of my culture to please anyone else & I’m not going to pretend that eating animals is the worst thing we do as a society. I may be a cranky omnivore today. 

kyssthis16

kyssthis16:

soydulcedeleche:

singingoverbones:

talldarkbishoujo:

soydulcedeleche:

i keep seeing vegan arguments fly by my dash.

one thing i noticed…alot of vegan people will acknowledge economic privilege…lack of access to shit….but often times in the same sentence they will go into “but if you have access to it, and you know about it and you still arent vegan, youre a shitty person”. *record scratch*

if you have said this, CHECK. YO. SELF.

ever heard of fucking culture? and free will? wtf?

theres something real fuckin imperialist, rooted in whiteness, ima say (and this applies even if you aint white—if you are pushing this shit), about assuming your way of life is the ONE right way —that you can somehow apply it worldwide, without fault, and anyone who doesnt agree is automatically savage, perverse or the enemy.

do these particular vegans not realize most of the issues theyre railing against are a result of capitalism, industrialization, globalization? and that you cant take some movement made up by privileged white assholes and expect it to just magically apply universally? i dont care wtf you think your cause is.

if the whole fucking world actually had access to vegan shit….they still wouldnt be obligated to adhere to such a lifestyle and none of you holier-than-thou assholes could say shit. you dont get it yet? lemme break it down.

if you came to MY house and explained veganism to me, and i, having access to all that shit, kindly DECLINED because i prefer to keep eating what me and my people have been eating for 985679878597 years and you want to say i am a BAD person for CHOOSING my own fucking cultural cuisine and traditions over your vegan evangelism, i will only tell you to GTFO and you’ll be lucky if i dont do it violently.

if, like many in my culture, i grew up raising my own fucking animals to eat in my backyard—- to prepare my cultures food with… and i believe that animals eat each other and i am another animal so this is normal (for those who are quick to cry speciesm, some of us eat animals precisely because we arent speciesist—we take good care of all animals (including the ones we eat), and assume we all consume each other so we arent above meat-eating? doesnt seem to occur to many)….frankly, you can condemn me to vegan hell all you fucking want. i will keep eating what ima eat, when i want to. know that.

i triple dog fucking DARE anybody to go tell some Natives in the Pampas or in Hawaii or East India or wherever to stop cooking the native dishes theyve held near and dear to their hearts…dishes theyve been cooking for 94867987805987 years, wearing skins or whatever else, so some smug developed world asshole can feel better about their carbon footprint.

anyway, those of yall who think that are dead fucking wrong for overlooking the entire fucking worlds culture and traditions like they dont even fucking exist or shouldnt matter…so long as your precious veganism is respected? how is that not straight up erasure? crock of shit, if nothing else.

do what you want. do it. but STFU about how everyone else is evil if they dont subscribe to your shit or DONT feel like giving up their fucking culture for your privileged, erasing ass, k?

So much word to all of this. Hell, even as someone with roots in the Southern US, what’s called “soul food” now came out of necessity because my ancestors didn’t have access to anything but the scraps and the bad parts left over from white people. We made do with what we had, and made it fucking delicious I might add. Food is inexorably rooted in culture and tradition and the stories and histories of people, the struggles and hardships and challenges, their connection to time and place. To waltz in and demand all of this change without any knowledge of or sensitivity regarding that context is the height of privilege denying ignorance, imo, and it makes me shake my head even harder when I see vegans of color doing it. Food is political and always has been, tied in with notions of Othering, etc. and it’s just ignorant to pretend otherwise. It kind of reminds me of hipster foodies and this “locavore” bullshit. Ignoring that “eating local” is what most of the world has done throughout most of time, because there was no other option, among other fuckery.

Also, can I just add that a lot of this stuff is also what squicks me about the evangelistic subset of obnoxious internet atheists? There’s more than a faint whiff of colonialism and White Man’s Burden nonsense involved (“these people need to be educated and pulled away from their superstitions!” <—how is this different than the largely white, western Christian missionaries that went in and destroyed whole religions and ways of life?), and it’s gross.

I sort of agree with this, but sort of don’t. I think it’s unfortunate that the intent and effect of veganism is lost on the mouths of those who assume the majority of people are able to go vegan, but I’m also disappointed in the militant defense of the choice to remain eating meat. I feel those who are defending this choice are emphasizing the thought that veganism is more about a carbon footprint, or for those who can afford it. Not all of us wine and dine at fancy vegan restauraunts, a vegan diet; when you get down to it, is made up of fruits, vegetables, nuts, grains, etc. Meaning, affordable things — staples, even.

If someone has a compromised immune system, or any other health issue, and does need to eat meat, I can’t say anything to them. I know that, and more people should recognize that — a lot of people assume veganism is all around a healthier lifestyle, for everyone, and it isn’t necessarily true, especially given however you are able to approach it given your economic status, place of living, etc…

I think culture preservation is important, and I’m not claiming to be extensively knowledgeable on how meat was obtained in all cultures, but the way most of us obtain meat *today*, as opposed to your ancestors from “94867987805987 years” ago, is entirely unethical, and an alienated process from food culture dating that far back, if you’re going to use it to defend your choice to eat meat. If you must continue eating meat, I have far less of a quarrel with those who raise and kill their own, simply from an anti-capitalist standpoint. However, the bit in this rant about being an animal, animals eat each other, etc., understand that no other animals use factory farming, so to assume you are “not above other animals and prove that by eating them”, understand that this procedure of securing meat is, infact, speciest, among many other horrible things.

ummm, you missed the point, which is, you dont have a right to have a “quarrel” with people for eating what they always have. you have a right to have a quarrel w industrialization and the other shit that made procuring meat this horrible yep, but 99% of what is sold in stores, what YOU BUY, is made on HUMAN slave labor. the fruit and veggies you eat are included. is it speciesist to want to save the animals but continue buying shit thats hurting PEOPLE? so yeah miss me w the fucking judgment.

point promptly fucking MISSED.